Mission: To respond thoughtfully and responsibly to my experiences of drinking and dining at restaurants with regard to the quality, service, preparation, presentation and overall experience received thereat. The standpoint is one who respects the crafts of the chef and sommelier and who seeks to understand their choices in the kitchen and cellar and grow in knowledge. In this, I will seek to be fair, reasoned, direct and constructive and aim to keep my ego in check on our mutual journeys through the worlds of food and wine.

Thursday, October 9, 2014

Tokaji Wine at Lai Po Heen - unbelievably good!!

Holdvölgy Wine Dinner at Lai Po Heen, Mandarin Oriental Hotel, Kuala Lumpur September 19th 2014

Bit of an odd one this - got the email for the dinner from Dave at Artisan Cellars and had originally decided against, given the price and the preponderance of sweet wines on offer. Not the best thing for a mild diabetic to suck down, notwithstanding his occasional desperation to feed his hugely sweet tooth. They did look attractive though, with glowing reports of their being lodged in a number of Michelin Star cellars. We don't get much quality Hungarian wines in KL, so there was a slight tinge of regret as the email declining the invite got sent. Then a few days later I get a call from Dave urging me to come and saying that he could get a good deal as opposed to the original price the organisers were looking to levy. Seems he persuaded them that the price needed dropping, and could I raise anyone else to go. He also said that only some of the wines were sweet. Lenglui had already decided against due to a massage having been booked for that night, but said I should go. A definite sign from the Wine and Food Gods. From our usual wine chugger groups I could only raise the Kiwi. So it would transpire that twelve people gathered around the table in the private room of the Lai Po Heen restaurant to sample Chef Ricky Thein's best and some Hungarian wines from the Holdvölgy vineyards. We were also to be sommeliered to by Peter Teng, Head Sommelier at the hotel and past winner of Malaysia Sommelier and South-East Asia Sommelier of the Year contests in 2010. We would also be joined by Natalia Demko from Holdvölgy to help explain the wines and tell us about the vineyard.

Aszu grape before getting Nobly Rotten
My only memory of Hungarian wine was the Tiger Milk I would occasionally chug at parties in the early 1980s and some ropey red stuff we had during a three day visit to Budapest in 2006 with an occasional cheek burning Tokaji at the odd wine dinner here and there. There was also one occasion at the Lake Club when someone brought some in for a wine dinner and it turned out to be pretty grim drinking. Having said that, the Tokaji region has been producing wine under state regulation for over 250 years (predating Bordeaux) so there must be some good stuff in there somewhere. And indeed, the output from the Holdvölgy vineyard appears to be becoming the stuff of legend. Translating into "Valley of the Moon", Holdvölgy started life as a birthday gift from current owner Pascal Demko's mother to her husband. In this, Pascal was tasked by mother to go find vines to plant in this parcel of volcanic soil based land in the Mad basin in the district of Tokaji. This has now grown to 19 parcels on seven sites across 25 hectares, with the wines finding their way on to the lists of a growing number of Michelin Star restaurants. Holdvölgy produces a range of wines from grape varietals that have little meaning to most of us - Furmint, Aszu, Harslevelu, Zeta - and gives each wine an evocative name that, er, evokes some form of contemplation - Meditation, Expression, Intuition. Seems owner Pascal is very particular about the wines produced - story goes he held on for four vintages before releasing his wines. Grapes from the 19 parcels across the seven vineyard Crus are harvested by hand for separate vinification in small steel tanks. Fermentation and ageing of the dry wines is mainly in steel though with some used oak whilst the sweet wines get aged in a mix of French and Hungarian oak. Only wild yeasts are used. 

Aszu Grape with Noble Rot
As said, was not originally enamoured with the idea of sweet gluggy wines with Chinese style food, but what a belting night it turned out to be. Individually, both wines and food were magnificent, but when paired with some superb service and wine knowledge and a charming if slightly austere ambience it was stellar. Seriously one of the best wine and food matchings I have sat down to. 

It didn't start too well - I was eventually a bit late. I would have been way on time, but trying to get into the Mandarin Hotel car park proved a fools errand and needed to get given up as a bad job. It would have taken a clear twenty minutes to get to the gate and a further fifteen trying to find a space. Whilst sat there waiting, I remembered the last time I had tried to get into the Mandarin Car Park - got to the gate only to be told that the thing was full and I would have to go park in the KLCC and walk across. Given this I decided to cut loss and go straight to KLCC. This proved to end up being a tour around the Twin Tower to get into the car park entrance and another ten minutes trying to figure out how to get to the Parkson (which would be the best spot to get out from). Somehow the car park directions didn't seem to want to let me get there, and I had to double back a couple of times until I got a familiar landmark (Isetan!) and was then able figure it all out from there. Add to this the slowness of the lifts and I was a bit hot and bothered by the time I got to the restaurant. Had a similar recent experience with the Westin - little chap in the rain there with a Car Park Full sign and no indication where else could park. Madness when you can barely get into a hotel entrance these days. Is this a trend? Car Parks being unable to cope with the volume of cars when multiple functions are taking place? Think I might give up Hotel restaurants. 

Furmint Grape and Leaf
Enough. I got there before the food came out. The Kiwi had earlier texted me to say they were starting, and he was sat opposite with Roderick Wong, Founder of The Wine Academy and President of the Sommelier Association of Malaysia. Holdvölgy External Relations Rep Natalia Demko sat between Chad Merchant from The Expat and Bel from the MO.  Also there was old friend and colleague from HELP College Danny and wife and some new friends joining the party from Singapore. Dave from Artisan Cellars was resplendent in a funky shirt and jacket which kind of matched each other in a modish sort of way. As said the room felt a bit austere with its corporate gold and brown feel and high walls built to impress and intimidate. The lighting was a bit on the bright side, and not helped by the sparkling silver table cloth (presume the Moon?) and pristine white tableware. The people also seemed a bit stiff, perhaps intimidated by the austere walls and furniture. Or maybe a bit peeved because I was late. It all felt like it needed a bit of warming up. Which would happen. We are party people.

The "Meditation"
Sitting down and apologising for the madness parking, the nice man with the wine gave me a glass of Wine One, the "Meditation". Made from dry non-botrytised Furmint grapes, the notes said it was "Crisp and racy…with a very appealing corpulence. Fresh ripe flavours of apricot, citrus, mirabelle, and acacia and with an almond and rock salt complexity. Intense, incisive, a beautifully ripe and refreshingly mineral Furmint." I got a Gewurz kind of feel in the mouth, with a crabapple tang and tropical fruit a la chardonnay. Passion fruit, and citrus lemon which gave the wine its "racy". Nicely complex, though I missed the crisp somewhere. Perhaps I was just thirsty. It chugged very nicely. 

Holdvolgy's Natalia Demko
Holdvölgy's Natalia Demko gave a brief description of the winery and its wines and shared photos of the vineyard and grapes on an iPad. It all looked very pretty and the photos were well shot. Presume with the surname there is a family relation with owner Pascal, though no one seemed to find out for sure [Natalia is Pascal's sister - Ed]. Too busy looking at the grape shots. And drinking. Looked definitely worth a visit, though looking at the map it would be a real adventure. About 200 clicks north west of Budapest toward the border with Slovakia. Anyone speak Hungarian? Exactly...

The Chilled Crabmeat Rolls came out looking like tiny samosas in thin glasspaper pastry. Little bit bland in the mouth, a smear of mango on the plate gave a good and needful zap on the gunge-y mayonnaise crab texture which made things quite pleasant and let everything slip past the cheeks with ease. A good mouthful, with a good crunch foundation provided by some redcurrant and cucumber in the roll. Matching wise, the combo cut the citrus on the wine quite nicely which suppressed its raciness quite severely. This gave rise to a hit of spicy honey, and something that felt almost coconut. A fair and easy start to whet the palate. 

Chilled Crab Meat Rolls
Wine Two "Expression" came out ahead of the food. The Holdvolgy Facebook page has a note on the 2009 "Expression", holding it to be "complex in the nose, smoky-stony minerality, different spices, peach and citrus. Tense with beautiful acidity, proportional structure, very nice long finish. On the palate a lot of citrus, pear and spices. With full of fresh notes, still a young wine that has not yet reached its peak." Okay. I got a somewhat sour mouth and finish at first which gave way to honey, spice and almond down the glass. So it goes. 

The "Expression"
Some wines do have a great sense of the terroir about them, not only in a plot sense but often in a national sense. Spain and South Africa come to mind, each with that sense of baked red brick about them. I got similar with the "Expression" - there's a unique Balkan tang, a sharp rip of fiery fruit acid on the throat, almost industrial and evoking (?) impressions of proletarian Soviet domination some of us vaguely remember from occasional TV news coverage in the early Eighties. A fierce grip reminiscent of the bottles of Tiger Milk we would chug though in fairness this one was far bigger in both width and depth terms. Firm and full, with great fruit.  A memory comes to mind of Ma Slade, the mum of my old band mucker Martin in Barry keeping a bottle in the fridge and sharing a glass with me in the kitchen. Wow, wines of the 1980s - Tiger Milk, Blue Nun, Black Tower and other grim things. Bull's Blood was another. Wine to put hairs on the chest. I digress.

Double Boiled Chicken Soup
The Double Boiled Chicken Soup was very good, with the added Fish Maw lending a sense of the opulent and tasting extremely fine. The use of Mineral water to make the soup was a first for me and really softened the broth into a fine clean easy liquid. There was a great sense of finesse in the texture of this broth. The chicken helped tame its light spice whilst the fish maw and scallop were totally fresh in taste and texture. Certainly one of the better ones I have had. Not overdone with salt or MSG. Very very good. 

Wine-wise, the "Meditation" felt a better match than the "Expression". "Meditation" gave off manuka honey, with a rich toffee note coming through whilst "Expression" just got neutralised. Belter. 

I started sharing with my foodie neighbour what I did and he gave a delightful summation - the "endless exploration of wines and foods and their matches." Wow. When someone gets unexpectedly lyrical like that, tends to make you feel both linguistically inadequate yet wildly excited at the same time. Got me feeling like Don Quixote in the Man of La Mancha singing "The Impossible Dream" - This is my quest… to follow that star… the Wine Star. Well, I suppose someone has to...

The "Eloquence"
Wine Three was the "Eloquence". This is made from a varietal called Szamorodni, which the notes say is on the way to total dessert sweetness but which holds slightly back from being a firm belt of sugar. The notes say the grapes are semi botrytised which "give great complexity in to the wine without any loss of freshness, Spiced pear, nectarines and tangerine all flood the mouth…  a wonderfully precise, pure and graceful glass of Tokaji." 

Szamorodni Grape
Have to agree. "Eloquence" is aptly named, possessing a delightful texture - not quite full on dessert unctuous, yet with a great structure and mouth feel. Like sipping on a light Riesling dessert wine but with brilliant zinging acidity. Very, very nice. Could sip this one all night and over the weekend. Pour this one over ice cream and aiyo…..

The next dish was the Slow Cooked Two Headed Abalone. This was serious quality top end Chinese delicacy. We were advised that the two head compares to "doubling" which in the cultural context means big time premium. Kind of like "double happiness" we were having double abalone. At least I think that is what I heard. Online research seems to suggest that the heads relate to the weight of the abalone.  One Yahoo answer has it that the 'heads' are counted in 600g being equal to 1 kati. So a One Headed Abalone means there is only one abalone in a kati (or each one is 600g). A Two Headed means there are two abalone to one kati, which becomes 300g each. This would seem to suggest that the younger (and lighter) the abalone then the sweeter the meat, which seems to be borne out by some of the blogs. 

Slow Cooked Two Head Abalone in Golden Broth - wooooooooooo....
Usually I take such bluff and fluff with a pinch of euphemistic salt, but on this occasion it was well merited. The Abalone was the total business. Taste, texture, and a firm full bite and bounce in the flesh. Very lightly steamed and far from overseasoned. At Chinese style dinners when I get served the Abalone, I normally leave it in the centre Lazy Susan for others who more appreciative of this delicacy to enjoy. This time I was ready to steal any leftovers on the plates from neighbours. The Golden Broth in which the Abalone was being soaked was equally delightful - full taste without oil or salt. New friend Adrian asked for some steamed plain white rice to help soak up the broth which proved genius. The rice helped bring out a new dimension in the broth, a more satisfying belt on the palate and a needful thunk of carbo landing in the stomach. Wow wow wow wow wow. Score a big one to the chef for this one. Pairing it with some asparagus was clever, to give a stalky vegetal contrast to the clean bite on the Abalone. Totally Memorable. Cracker of a dish.

The "Eloquence" got its zingy acid cut savagely by the Double Head broth, but all this did was allow some rich honey and a massive toffee note to come through. Love this wine - great balance and structure, lot of complexity and it just gives and gives. The total business.

Guests and ambience
It was refreshing to see the staff being quite generous with the wine servings. Top-ups were swift and welcome. Sommelier Peter Teng showed why he is Champion with his explanations of the dishes and the wine matchings as they came to the table. For our fourth dish, I thought I heard him say that the Foie Gras we would be having was from China. He further advised that very good Foie Gras is available from China, and seemed to suggest that the quality of the Foie Gras was due to early European influence in China. Okay…   I know the French were in Indochina, and duck and goose are indeed favourite birds across the Chinese mainland. Google research shows that French manufacturers are producing it on the Chinese mainland to get around an import ban on FG in the face of rising mainland demand for it. Guess there is some spillover which is how it finds its way here. But people in China manufacturing Foie Gras on their own for consumption was a new one. Not much on the web on this either. Have to dig a bit deeper on this one. Perhaps I heard wrong.

Fragrant Fried Rice with Foie Gras
The idea of pairing Foie Gras with Chinese Fried Rice seemed a bit like eating Caviar with a bag of Fries (I call them Chips - chipped potatoes deep fried). But it kind of worked. On its own, the Fried Rice was clearly composed of premium ingredients in its preparation, though the resulting combo felt a shade snuzz - far from bad, but not brilliantly memorable. The rice was full of spice and savoury, and perhaps that was the issue for me - all spice and air and lacking a decent bit of substance. Whilst spice and savoury tend to nicely supercharge the taste of the wines with which they get paired, they can get in the way of the tasting. The tastebuds get a bit seared and numb and the whole exercise ends up redundant. I'm also guessing that the rice was fried in some light oil since there was very little taste in the rice grains. Far from the hearty and stick-in-the-craw servings you get at the Marco Polo or the Overseas. But then, we are at the Mandarin Oriental, so greater finesse is more expected and required. Can't expect Marco Polo soul food at upmarket Hotels. Fair enough.

The Foie Gras got kind of absorbed into the rice when put into the mouth. The starch seemed to suck the FG texture to weld both into a neat bite of rice that saltily skipped along the tongue and teeth and into the oblivion of the gullet with little in the way of fuss. Or real fanfare, actually. I think I missed it. I have eaten Foie Gras with Toasted Bread on the streets of Paris and this pairing was magnificent. But tonight at the Lai Po Heen, it all seemed about the texture. Which was delightful, don't get me wrong - just seemed to lack a bit of "thunk" in the mouth. Maybe one of those East vs West things - texture vs taste. Using rice as a carbo support may need a bit of time for me. Be interesting to find out if pairing Foie Gras with Fried Rice is standard restaurant practice in Hong Kong and Beijing.

The "Signature"
The Rice and FG was being paired with the "Signature". This was a blend of nobly rotted furmint, harslevelu and zeta grapes and is the wine that maker Pascal calls his Maserati - "modern, fast and edgy". He has not presented this wine for Tokaji classification, which requires certain compliance conditions to be met. Seems he enjoys the liberation this gives him and as a result he is able to fine tune the blend if felt necessary. The notes indicate "aromatics of marmalade honey. Rich and sweet on the palate balanced by the crisp acidity. Very refreshing, not cloying."

I found it delightfully smooth and far from sugary. Medium body, clean finish, rich in its coating of the mouth. Seems the Furmint grape has a naturally high acidity, so when it gets botrytised it manages to mitigate that cloying quality that plagues many dessert style offerings. It also means that it can both age and be drunk young. It was magnificent - felt like sucking on a bee hive without the sting. In matching terms, it was an amazing choice to pair with the Foie Gras. It blitzed the wine into a spicy textural zap on the mouth and cheeks and seemed to bring out a light fire (though in retrospect this could have been the chili in the scallop sauce). 

The remnants of Wine Three "Eloquence" also worked wonderfully, though in a somewhat lighter sense. The weight of the wine was less powerful and it was perhaps this quality that gave a greater sense of the complementary - staying out of the way of the sweeter elements of the food to create a softer balance.Like comparing a gentle kiss on the cheek to a full on lip-lock. Phoooooooo…. We were still getting top ups of the "Eloquence", though the "Signature" seemed to have disappeared. Someone must have really sucked on that bottle. Might have been me...

On the home stretch now, and getting a bit more lively around the table. Wine will do that. It truly is an amazing creation. When people are laughing with each other, how can they fight? Makes me think some parts of the world could well learn from this.

Dessert got served. On its own, it seemed to lack bite and body. Texturally, the Yam Cake came over as a cross between a mousse and a blancmange and consequently felt a bit thin and creamy light in body. Combined with the ice cream on some glutinous rice bits, it came off like cold milky goo with crispish nibs. But it grew on you. Its apparent bland and purple airiness became quite easing on the palate after the assault from the rice and foie gras. Again, an East vs West thing where a heavy dish is followed by a light one to allow the system to breathe. And it worked - the body was very happy to take a break and get some "air".

Sweetened Yam Cake and Purple Glutinous Rice
Dessert was being paired with the "Intuition", a Muscat that was a blend of both botrytised and non-botrytised grapes from a single vineyard. The notes talk about "ultra exotic ripe tropical fruits, honey and petroleum. Vivacious and lively in the mouth [with] honeyed botrytised fruits… beguiled by aromatic wood spice elements". We found it nicely firm (though not so much as a full on Tokaji) yet with enough heft to support the liquid milky texture of the dessert. A good floral nose and feel, with a spicy acidity that whipped the tonsil on the way past (is this what they call the mid palate?) and seemed to suck all the spit from the throat. Bit like having a rub down around the mouth with a paper towel. Real ripper. 

The "Intuition"
Given the context of light following heavy, the selection of the Muscat definitely worked - a more syrupy textured wine would have killed the delicacy of the Yam and ice cream. Excellent choice to pair these two. 

The nice man with the wine came around with remnants of the bottles and asked if we would like some more of any that was left. I picked Number Three. Then Number Two. He kindly obliged. Other friends picked their favourites. We sucked up the lot.  All the wines showed great finesse. Wine Two especially - the "Expression" still felt frisky in the glass at the end of the night though it had gotten a bit stinky. Wine One "Meditation" was still light and fragrant - airy, breathless, full of light and breeze. Wine Three "Eloquence" still had lovely texture, full and chewy despite its lower sugar levels. As said, Wine Four "Signature" had long disappeared and little more was forthcoming. The Kiwi suggested we should buy for the IWFS. Fully agree. 

With the wines still on the table, it was actually pleasant to get served a cup of tea at this juncture. The wines were all pretty unctuous in their bodies and hot tea became the perfect throat cleaner. The little chocolate petits fours were also quite delightful and made for a perfect end to a brilliant evening. 

Very little to fault here. Certainly felt like enough food had been served. No one seemed to feel the need for more and everyone was clearly replete and mellow at the end. 

Executive Chef Ricky Thein, Holdvolgy's Natalia Demko and Head Sommelier Peter Teng
The matches between food and wines were brilliantly thought through. Holdvölgy's Natalia felt that the pairing showcased more complexity in her wines, saying that "with this type of Chinese food I discovered other aspects of our wines. For example for Meditation walnut and hazelnut notes came up that I’ve never experienced before. This type of pairing just showed the perfect teamwork of Peter Teng, the Head Sommelier and Chef Ricky Thein."  Absolutely.

I think I'm slowly getting to grips with the concept of complexity, though it does occasionally seem that terms like finesse, complexity and other wine terms can mean different things to different people. My old Law Professor always demanded that one determine one's standpoint in all things - here goes. For me, if there's more to a wine than what is first tasted and which is brought out by good food, then the wine has complexity. It's kind of like that umami factor in food - there's also an umami factor in wine beyond the traditional balance across alcohol, acidity, tannin, alcohol and fruit. Add the layers of spice and texture that can impact and elevate this fermented grape juice to the sublime and we start to get a sense of why some of us shell out silly sums of money for a taste of it. Trying to describe such complexities feels a bit beyond me at times. And truth be told I can't really get that motivated to fully articulate those complexities - feeling a bit too old to try and learn the complete language of wine and would rather be drinking and commenting with the vocabulary to hand. Feels a bit more real for some reason. And I also think that getting too anal will turn people away. Tends to turn me off when I read other more oenological blogs. Keep it an easy light read - no point to get too scientific with what should be fun, eh? 

[sings as he exits] "This is my Quest…"  [fades out]

Lai Po Heen Executive Chef Ricky Thein
(pic courtesy of Chad Merchant)
Lai Po Heen Menu

Chili Crab Meat Rolls, Mango and Passion Fruit Mayonnaise
Tokaji Furmint "Meditation" Holdvology 2007

Double Boiled Chicken Soup - Natural Mineral Water with Fish Maw and Cordycep Bulb
Tokaji Harslevelu "Expression" Holdvology 2007

Slow Cooked Two Headed Abalone in Golden Broth
Tokaji Szamorodni "Eloquence" Holdvology 2007

Fragrant Black Sesame Fried Rice with Spicy Scallop Sauce, Foie Gras and Asparagus - Sprinkled with Fish Roe
Tokaji Selection "Signature" Holdvology 2007

Sweetened Yam Cake and Purple Glutinous Rice, Vanilla Ice Cream
Muscat "Intuition No 2" Holdvology 2008

Sweet Sensations with Coffee or Tea

Lai Po Heen
Mandarin Oriental Kuala Lumpur
Tel +(603) 2380 8888

Lai Po Heen Sweet Sensations (pic courtesy of Chad Merchant)

Holdvölgy (Moon Valley) Wines Notes

Wine One
 Meditation Furmint 2007
A dry, non-botrytised Furmint from four single vineyard parcels, 80% fermented and aged in steel tanks, 20% in used oak barrels. Crisp and racy as you would expect from a Furmint with a very appealing corpulence. Fresh ripe flavours of apricot, citrus, mirabelle, and acacia and with an almond and rock salt complexity. Intense, incisive, a beautifully ripe and refreshingly mineral Furmint.

Wine Two
 Expression Harslevelu Becsek 2009
From the Holdvolgy single vineyard. Fermented using healthy non botrytised fruit in steel tanks with further ageing in tanks sur lie. Bright, floral and expressive notes of dried flower, chervil and honeycomb, the palate is bursting with similarly complex and intense flavours of stonefruit, butter, herb, hazelnut and almond, together with a racy lemon rind quality. A wine of great depth, character and exuberance.

Wine Three
 Eloquence Szamorodni Sweet 2007
A glorious sweetie from Holdvolgy that sits a step before full Aszu on the sweetness scale. The team harvest whole bunches which are then destemmed before being crushed These semi botrytised grapes give great complexity in to the wine without any loss of freshness, Spiced pear, nectarines and tangerine all flood the mouth. Harvested at 104g/l this is a wonderfully precise, pure and graceful glass of Tokaji.

Zeta Grape and Leaf
Wine Four - 2007 
 Signature Sweet Blend
Made from the furmint, harslevelu and zeta grapes. The grapes are late harvested and infected with the noble rot botrytis. The fungus penetrates the skin, increasing the sugar content and concentrating the flavours. Demko describes Signature as the "Maserati of wines" : it is modern, fast and edgy. This wine allows him the freedom to do what he wants, unconstrained by Tokaji regulations. For example, he may blend dry wines to increase the acidity of the wine. On the nose, aromatics of marmalade honey. Rich and sweet on the palate balanced by the crisp acidity. Very refreshing, the 125g/l of sugar is not cloying.

Wine Five 
 Intuition No 2 Muscat 2008
Muscat a Petits Grains, with a blend of botrytised and non botrytised bunches from the single vineyard of Nyulaszo. 99g/l residual sugar Only 1,200 500ml bottles produced. A unique nose that mixes ultra exotic ripe tropical fruits, honey and petroleum. Vivacious and lively in the mouth thanks to high acidity. Its honeyed botrytised fruits are beguiled by aromatic wood spice elements. Slightly lower in acidity that the Aszu but also less sweet overall in terms of residual sugar, Slithery and chewy in the mouth with lovely silkiness and lingering mango inner mouth perfume. 

Photos of grapes and logo from Holdvolgy Facebook page

Dave Chan at Artisan Cellars
+6012 7103278
email dave@artisan-cellars.com

More photos and perceptive reflections available at the excellent Doc Wine site. Check them out at


  1. Great write up.I have some more photos at https://www.facebook.com/Doc.Wine.StephenjHall

  2. Thanks for dropping by my blog. I agree with you that the parking in the city centre (especially at certain times) can be quite horrific. Glad you had some good wine to ease the pain however. ;-)

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